Viclore

This is part of a series of interviews that I conducted as part of The Chevrons Project. Roman is a Kyiv resident who I met at an English speaking club.

Vic: Could you tell us your name and a little about yourself?

Roman: My name is Roman, I live in Kyiv in Ukraine, I’m a Ukrainian and I’m 40 years old. I live in Ukraine all my life, I’m an engineer, and I guess that’s all.

Vic: Were you in Kyiv during the siege at the start of the war?

Roman: Yeah yeah I was in Kyiv at the start, in my apartment.

Vic: Wow, how was that?

Roman: It was, yeah, it was I would say quite scary. At first moment I woke up from explosions, they were quite far but it was quite distinct that it was something not okay. We knew that, it was in the news before that the situation was quite dangerous already, but nobody believed that this really can start. And these explosions meant that it was really starting, the war started. I opened my phone and saw the official announcement, war announcement- and it was quite scary. I have some let’s say panic, I would say moments. I have trembling hands and yeah, a bit of a nervous state. Then I phoned my friends and relatives, I did some exercises to get myself in my arms[1], and yeah, we started to basically think what to do. First days was very very nervous I think, I cannot sleep at night, and there was also some already attacks on Kyiv at first days, so I think it was very nervous time.

Vic: Since the start of the full-scale invasion, have you done much volunteer work?  Or have you been busy with normal work?

Roman: Yeah, first I was busy with some handling of usual things in my life. Where to live, how to be, what to do with my job, and what with my family and relatives and friends, and don’t know what. Yeah but volunteering, we have some activity in our company, we support those who was involved in army from our company. We donate and do some, let’s say, those guys who were going and in army they have some needs. They ask us to do some things, buy some things. The first time it was basic things because it was not fast enough- supply in army was not fast enough, so we needed to supply something for our colleagues. And now we have some regular commitments let’s say. Usually its money.

Vic: So you mentioned before the start of this interview you’ve not received any chevrons through your support of the military?

Roman: Mmm.

Vic: But you said that you could ask your friends to give you them?

Roman: Yeah actually I can ask, I think it’s okay.

Vic: Is that a common thing, for people to ask soldiers to give them chevrons?

Roman: I think that for those who let’s say actively participate and actively communicate with those who are in army, who are military who defend our country, they would like to have them because for them it’s like a symbol of participation and commitment.

Vic: So how do you feel to have not received one yet?

Roman: I feel okay because I do not participate much, and I do not communicate much with the army soldiers actually.

Vic: Okay. If you did receive one, what would you do with it?

Roman: I will keep it, and it will be for me like a symbol of connection and participation with those people who give me this.

Vic: Would you ever wear it on a bag or a hat?

Roman: Probably yes, currently I do not feel much to say if I will deserve it because I did not commit much in some particular, I don’t know how to say- I don’t feel that I have participated in something so much that I will need to show it.

Vic: So if you see someone with a chevron do you assume that they’ve done a lot of work for whatever units chevron they have?

Roman: I would assume it, yeah.

Vic: What do you think when you see chevrons like my ones that have clearly been bought in a random shop rather than being from the military?

Roman: I would say that its, yeah you want to show your support for those people.

Vic: What do you think about the shops where you can buy chevrons that look like they’re from the military unit but they’re obviously not officially from the military?

Roman: Yeah, I think it’s okay for those people who lets say cannot participate directly but want to say do something, or at least say something- so it’s at least a way to say that we support military forces.

Vic: So if there was a unit that you felt particularly close to or wanted to show your support for, you would be happy to go buy one yourself for that unit?

Roman: Yeah I think that it’s okay, it’s possible. I think that in my case it’s a bit low support <laughs> I should do more actually, but in general it’s a way to participate.

Vic: I know it’s a bit of a difficult one to quantity, but do you have a rough idea of how much work you feel someone should do for a company or military brigade before they’ve earned a chevron?

Roman: Yeah it’s difficult to define, um.

Vic: Say someone did a weekend worth of work for a unit?

Roman: I think it depends on how much the person, what kind of resources this person has. Some persons have a lot of resources, and they can participate a lot. Let’s say some persons have more resources they can give, comfortably more. Other persons doesn’t have much of anything but they still can do something, and for them it’s still a contribution as they can. I don’t think that it’s possible to measure in some quantities and I don’t think that it needs to be measured. I think that chevrons is some symbol and itself it doesn’t cost a lot, but it’s a symbol of effort, and if these efforts were enough it should be given.

Vic: After victory, do you think that there will be a market for people trying to buy chevrons from people that have had them given to them by soldiers?  Like will people try and start collections of chevrons, will people want to-

Roman: Oh! Yeah I think it’s quite possible, it will be. I am not the one who let’s say collects something, there are people who collect some things and for me it’s looking strange but if other markets exist too then why not this market will appear.

Vic: Yeah. So if a military unit was to give you a chevron, what would that mean to you?

Roman: For me, it should be some- that I did something, some contribution. I don’t think that it’s just for nothing.

Vic: I’ve seen the certificates that people give to people, подяка[2]?  The certificates from the military acknowledging that you’ve done something good.

Roman: Ahhh yes, we have. The company has it.

Vic: Would you rather receive one of those or a chevron off of a soldier?

Roman: For me chevron would be more genuine or authentic. Cause you know its symbol, and they usually have some specific signs on it. And certificates usually are standardised, and have the same more or less for all.

Vic: You mentioned earlier that you could probably ask your friends for a chevron. Is it in your opinion rude to ask a soldier to give you a chevron?

Roman: Yeah first of all I would ask those who we support, and I would say this is important, why I can ask. Just ask because I need a chevron, for me it’s something inappropriate.

Vic: Yeah, okay. Would you say in general that there’s- that chevrons are important to Ukrainian people within wartime culture?

Roman: Yeah I think that chevrons is important, it’s something- a symbol that people can unite, that they see each other that they are from one team. Distinguish themselves from let’s say other people. It’s quite important and I think it’s quite an ancient way to communicate in society to foreign groups.

Vic: Do you think that having a chevron for a group of soldiers makes you feel more connected to that group? Like if as a volunteer they gave you one.

Roman: Yeah, that would.

Vic: Could it be a way of maintaining a bond with that group?

Roman: Yeah, I think it will facilitate this.

Vic: Cool, that’s all the questions I had. Do you have any other general things you’d like to say about chevrons?

Roman: No.

Vic: Okay, thank you for your time!

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[1] A literal translation of a Ukrainian idiom which means to take care of yourself

[2] Translates as “thanks”